Introduce Yourself

Welcome back Brother diode .

Since the demise of EP and the start of this group, there has been no 'majic bullet' discovery, and ones' options remain pretty much the same as ever they were back in the EP days.

A misperception.

There is clearly a push to attract and retain members of the group. Strategies to this end seem to involve the entreating of the "lurkers" and the urging of new members to post their stories.

I can perhaps shed a bit of light on the issue, as I had been a member for a few years, left for a few years then very recently returned to reassess the landscape and atmosphere of the group.

To begin, the primary reason for my departure rests with the emerging character of the group of the day. The personality of this (or most any) online group tends to reflect the personalities and behaviors of the most prolific contributors. Owing to the tendencies of a particularly prolific contributor, I found it increasingly difficult to make myself understood. He/she responded to virtually every post. He/she often drew erroneous conclusions and then struck with what may have been interpreted as "tough love." For a time, I tried to counter the responses to my posts with "corrections." These had no apparent impact on the views of the contributor nor on the tendency of others to adopt those views. In other words, being loudest for longest handily trumped accuracy. I gave up and left.

Concerning my reintroduction, I received a number of nice welcomes (for which I'm grateful). On the other hand, my first and rather vague post was scarcely 24 hours old, and I had already been subtly labeled as "Choosing to Stay." This does not bode well for my enduring presence. I certainly won't be accepting an invitation to post my story any time soon. It seems like a lot of effort to invest to risk getting run over.

In the interests of attracting and retaining participants, I have the following preliminary suggestions:
1. Emphasize kindness over tough love. Being the "smartest guy in the room" can backfire.
2. Emphasize question marks over exclamation points. Kindly ask questions instead of propagating hard-to-undo assumptions. New members ought not to have to sweat to make themselves understood.
3. Less can be more -- one does not need to respond to every post. Giving somebody else a chance to speak might pay dividends.

Will I stick around? Yes, for now, but I'm watchfully uncommitted.

Northstarmom:
“I was the one who suggested, "Choosing to stay," as you'd been with your wife a long time and did not express here any interest in leaving. I also know that, the old EP didn't have a Choosing to Stay option and that drove some people away because they didn't feel that their choice was respected. I thought maybe that's why you'd left, so offered Chosing to Stay in case that fit your situation. If it doesn't, there are other forums here that might. It's up to you whether to post on them.

Whether you stay or leave here is up to you just as it's up to you about whether to stay or leave your marriage. What you choose to disclose also is up to you as is whose advice you decide to take or to ignore. Just realize that people here who take the time to respond are taking time out of their own lives to try to help you. They are attempting to be kind, whether or not you take their actions that way. The advice they give is also based on their own experiences as well as what you choose to share. No one here is a mind reader. If you'd feel more comfortable in a place in which you might feel more trusting and comfortable about providing more details about your situation, having an individual therapist might be an option that works for you. I didn't find EP until I was out of my SM and with a new partner. A good individual therapist -- who listened well and gave feedback in a way that I could absorb -- was what helped me leave the dry hell of my marriage and create a life that I enjoy. It took me a while to find the right therapist, but when I did, with her support, I changed my life and myself so I'm now the kind of person I'd always admired, and I'm living a life that I enjoy instead of just enduring.”

I will respond to this post, as it offers a masterclass relevant to Suggestion # 2 (my prior post above).

A. It was suggested that I may have been among those fleeing EP because their choices to stay weren't respected. I was only there during the final days. Because it folded, I didn't need to quit for any reason.

B. It was suggested that I might feel more comfortable in an individual therapy session. I made no allusion to avoiding individual therapy.

So, irrespective of how I might respond, there is a likelihood that participants may conclude that "diode left EP because he was upset that his choice to stay in a sexless marriage wasn't respected. Further, diode shuns individual therapy." The residue of erroneous assumptions/assertions has impact. The impact of this residue is easily demonstrated as a principle of mentalist tricks (it doesn't much matter what happens or is said after the critical cue is dropped). In a far more extreme example, we're probably all familiar with the punch-in-the-gut-type question that a reporter might use on a politician (e.g., "So, just why is it that you hate women so much?). Combating erroneous assumptions is indeed exhausting and ultimately fruitless.

I'm not quite sure that I followed the intent of the latter paragraph (although I noted at least two additional embedded assumptions), as the topic I raised related specifically to strategies for attraction and retention of members. Irrespective of the volumes of effort invested in helping, no form of helping is without side-effects. One such side-effect might be the insidious thinning of our herd.

angelwanderer, I’m impressed that you caught the electronic metaphor. Well done, and Happy New Year.

I know you from elsewhere, and a pleasure it is to greet you again.

Hello, I've been on this forum in the past, but I left because it just seems that everyone says you must leave and I don't find that supportive at all. If I left, why would I be here? I'd be on a dating site instead. I'm trying again and I see that there must be more acceptance of the "choosing to stay" option?

Little suggestion:
On the Profile page, there's an "Update Status" button.

I wonder if this might be a good place to write something like:
"Staying for Now, Please Don't Suggest Divorce."
OR
"Devout. Divorce Not an Option"

or some similar sentiment.

I have a concern that many posts on forum categories other than "Choosing to Stay" interest our "Death Do We Part" contingent. They'd like to contribute or ask a question or invite feedback without having to handle responses that constitute "non-starters".

Adding the "Divorce of the Table" caveat to the profile may target other members advice and inquiries more directly?

Sorry you felt like everyone was saying "you must leave".
I must assure you and others that is not the case.

Some reasons for staying may have fixes. If finances are an issue, there's a thread dedicated to that obstacle.
If it's kids, the "college plan" may remedy that.
If it's devotion to God or your honor to preserve your vows, that one's pretty tough.

Some efforts are meant to eliminate obstacles not to compel you to divorce but to open the option should you decide it is on the table and you won't be stuck for having not prepared the ground.

Perhaps to some folks very invested in their keeping the  word to their spouse and/or God, even making it easier to divorce later is a betrayal.
Perhaps I engage in blatant rationalization of repugnant hair-splitting when I (and others) try to connect dots 1-9, so you can draw the line to number 10 if ever you're ready.
Connecting dots 1-9 may be seen as immoral or scary and the would-be advisors as devils on your shoulder.
Building temptation could be seen as a disservice and thoroughly unwelcome.
I hope such people will understand that it can be difficult to distinguish those who aren't leaving from those who never would.

More than once, one has become the other.
My saying that makes it sound like I'm cheerleading.
I most assuredly am not.
When I offer advice, it's almost always to outsource. Preferably with the spouse's full knowledge.
It is the weaselly way I can try to help the ILIASM subject at hand without running afoul of the public admonishment "What God has put together let no man put asunder".
I take that seriously. I do not wasn't to end anyone's marriage.
A key reason to divorce is to marry someone else.
Why bother? The next one is going to have problems too. Solve the one you've got. Or, build a life that largely ignores it.
That's the route some ILIASM members take, not uncommonly.

Perhaps some "clearing the way" has been interpreted as pushing over teh cliff when all we want to do is show you a prettier view? Staying in your marriage, but enjoying life more.
If we're standing on a ledge to get a better view, and invite you to come with us, offering you teh same parachute we have, that doesn't mean we say your should jump. It may be an offer to provide a sense of greater safety, even though you are, to a great degree, in total control of what happens on the mountain.

Acrophobes can wear a parachute even if they aren't anywhere close to the edge, but it seems inappropriate to get angry if offered one, and told how to put it on and where the ripcord is.
Still, if it gets you upset, that, too, could be reflected in the profile.