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Post by liltree on Mar 24, 2016 5:33:26 GMT -5
While my marriage wasn't salvageable, he's two books really helped me get into the right mindset both to attempt real change and compromise myself and showed me A LOT about what was going wrong in my marriage. The Five Love Languages by Gary Chapman www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/080241270X/7 Principles for Making Marriage Work by John Gottman, PhD www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/0553447718/ |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2016 10:13:50 GMT -5
I recommend The Five Love Languages, too. Whether or not it helps that particular relationship, it can help you to understand and get along with people better, in general.
One book I have mixed feelings about is The Sex Starved Marriage, by Michele Weiner. The good part is that she does attempt to show the refused one's side of the story. The bad part (IMHO) is that she seems to be one of those save-the-marriage-even-if-it-kills-you people. Also IMHO, by the time people find ILIASM, it's usually too late.
But the book is worth a look; I think most people will find something good there to think about.
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Post by bballgirl on Mar 24, 2016 13:36:35 GMT -5
I agree with Kat about the books.
5 Love Languages is a great tool to figure out
compatibility. I think it can boil down to
something as simple as that, you're either
sexually compatible or you're not.
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Post by greatcoastal on Mar 24, 2016 14:49:22 GMT -5
"Boundaries in Marriage" by Dr. Henry Cloud & Dr. John Townsend. My wife read this first and I asked her about it, she said, " it's teaching me how to say no!" I thought, " you've mastered that for 14 yrs!" So I read it myself. The other 90 percent that she missed is very helpful. I highlighted so much of it. Especially the " intruder" aspect of marriage.
the book " Boundaries" is more for someone who is, or has gone through a relationship with physical violence.
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Post by petrushka on Mar 24, 2016 23:14:54 GMT -5
I am very, very cautious around self-help books. Most of them, in my opinion, are just good to help one person, and that person is the author. They also tend to just focus on one thing, one idea, and then harp on about the same thing for 365 pages ... you can't go and read one self help book and then confidently diagnose your spouse as narcissistic ... because you really need a hell of a lot of background knowledge and context to do that. It's like trying to do brain surgery after reading one booklet about the hypothalamus.
Having said that, there's one book that I think is worth reading for people who are in a relationship where one person is a carebear and the other an addict alcoholic or similar: it's called "Women who love too much" by Robin Norwood.
It has a lot to say about the co-dependent person, how they come to be, and how they sabotage their own lives. If it can make some codependents realize where they are at, psychologically, and seek help, then that's a good result. It's certainly not going to enable you to fix yourself up, nor, I think does it make any claims to that end. Incidentally, that should really be "women and men who love too much".
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Post by DryCreek on Mar 25, 2016 15:32:34 GMT -5
Another thumbs-up for 5 Love Languages - specifically for the survey. It's very telling to discover that your spouse sees very little value in Touch, when many of us here rank highly in that category.
That survey would be a very wise move for dating couples. I think they should put it online with some immediate feedback, like "Danger! You're on track for a sexless marriage!", complete with links to woeful stories in this forum.
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Post by TMD on Mar 25, 2016 17:16:15 GMT -5
Hmm. Am I the only one who *hates* the "Five Love Languages?"
Not sure why, but the book and the "quiz" always made me sad or angry.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2016 18:43:38 GMT -5
Having said that, there's one book that I think is worth reading for people who are in a relationship where one person is a carebear and the other an addict alcoholic or similar: it's called "Women who love too much" by Robin Norwood. It has a lot to say about the co-dependent person, how they come to be, and how they sabotage their own lives. If it can make some codependents realize where they are at, psychologically, and seek help, then that's a good result. It's certainly not going to enable you to fix yourself up, nor, I think does it make any claims to that end. Incidentally, that should really be "women and men who love too much". I always thought there should be a counter-book called "Men Who Don't Love Enough." |
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Post by petrushka on Mar 27, 2016 0:05:12 GMT -5
Ha, I hear you - and as EP taught us, similarly 'women who don't love enough'. There's a few blokes here who can tell a tale or two about that. We certainly can write a book about the many kind of 'broken' or dysfunctional that both men and women can be in this respect. But this is not a juxtaposition. Norwood actually dismantles a myth. The people who "love too much", the co-dependents, are in themselves actually severely dysfunctional, people who cling to control in order to avoid repeating a traumatic past only to latch on to somebody whom they think they can 'remodel', 'fix', 'shape', and CONTROL (because people in need of help are clearly weak!) and here is the kicker: when the person at the other end of this relationship DOES get their shit together, then it usually becomes obvious that the co-dependent is not capable of maintaining a sane, grown-up, adult-adult relationship, they end up torpedoing their own life. It is my view from that perspective that the vast majority of refusers are victims carrying on in the same vein as what they are used to, rather than vicious conscious and intentional abusers and manipulators. Although those most certainly exist, I've met my share of them. |
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Post by Rhapsodee on Mar 27, 2016 14:03:47 GMT -5
I have gone onto Amazon to look at the five love languages book several times but there are 52 different versions! Good grief! Why can't I find the one size fits all version?
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Post by Rhapsodee on Mar 27, 2016 14:07:14 GMT -5
I recommend The Five Love Languages, too. Whether or not it helps that particular relationship, it can help you to understand and get along with people better, in general. One book I have mixed feelings about is The Sex Starved Marriage, by Michele Weiner. The good part is that she does attempt to show the refused one's side of the story. The bad part (IMHO) is that she seems to be one of those save-the-marriage-even-if-it-kills-you people. Also IMHO, by the time people find ILIASM, it's usually too late. But the book is worth a look; I think most people will find something good there to think about. I'd just burn it. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2016 19:16:32 GMT -5
One of my favorites is "His Needs, Her Needs" by Willard Harley.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2016 21:17:54 GMT -5
I recommend The Five Love Languages, too. Whether or not it helps that particular relationship, it can help you to understand and get along with people better, in general. One book I have mixed feelings about is The Sex Starved Marriage, by Michele Weiner. The good part is that she does attempt to show the refused one's side of the story. The bad part (IMHO) is that she seems to be one of those save-the-marriage-even-if-it-kills-you people. Also IMHO, by the time people find ILIASM, it's usually too late. But the book is worth a look; I think most people will find something good there to think about. I'd just burn it. What is it with you and fire, Deedle? Didn't you also burn some of the books you tried to get your husbro to read? LOL |
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Post by Rhapsodee on Mar 27, 2016 21:33:23 GMT -5
LOL, yes I did, if only all my anger burned with it.
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Post by Chatter Fox on Mar 28, 2016 10:07:54 GMT -5
I'm a self help book junkie. Here's some that are noteworthy, whether for good or bad content The good books I've found... 1.) Self Esteem by McKay and Fanning www.amazon.com/Self-Esteem-Cognitive-Techniques-Assessing-Maintaining/dp/1572241985/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1459175632&sr=8-1&keywords=self+esteemIn my opinion, ANYONE can benefit from this book greatly. As for those of us in a SM, it's worth it's weight in gold. This book isn't the kind of book you read though, it's the kind of book you work through. Every chapter has exercises that are meant to become daily habit. There's enough in this book to keep you busy for years. It's a LOT of work, but it pays off immensely. 2.) The Coward's Guide to Conflict by Tim Ursiny www.amazon.com/Cowards-Guide-Conflict-Empowering-Solutions/dp/1402200552/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1459175750&sr=8-1&keywords=Cowards+guide+to+conflict- This may not be for everyone, but if you are the kind that avoids conflict or allows your spouse to use scare tactics to keep you off the subject of your SM, then it will be very helpful to get you to push for answers in a way that will be respectful yet assertive. 3.) Too Good to Leave Too Bad to Stay by Mira Kirshenbaum www.amazon.com/Good-Leave-Stay-Step---Step/dp/0452275350/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1459175831&sr=8-1&keywords=too+good+to+leave+too+bad+to+stayThis book will help you figure out if everything truly is "fine bar the sex". It guides you through many questions to determine if you would be better off staying or leaving. I have read it twice so far. I plan to read it every 6 months to see if my answers change over time. I suggest writing down your answers in full detail as you read, so you can refer to them later. I like to use it to find problem areas in my marriage and see if I can change them.. and to see what my personal contribution to the troubles are. Both times I've read it have showed me many signs pointing me to the door. Therefore showing me that everything is indeed NOT fine bar the sex. An interesting slant, sex is not directly included in the questions, however, she notes that the whole book is really about sex. It's quite an interesting read. 4.) The Truth About Children and Divorce by Robert Emery www.amazon.com/Truth-About-Children-Divorce-Emotions/dp/0452287162/ref=sr_1_3?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1459176736&sr=1-3&keywords=divorce+childrenVERY good read! If you are getting to that point where you are eyeballing the door, this book is VERY important! It gives good advice on how to make the transition less difficult for your children. It provides research based opinions on the effect on kids and the news isn't all doom and gloom. It's all about HOW the divorce unfolds. The book tells you why. It also tells you HOW to arrive at a divorce that is the least harmful to your kids. It also helps you pave the way near the end of the marriage. There's a lot of good stuff in here. 5.) The 10 Stupidest Mistakes Men Make When Facing Divorce, and how to avoid them by Joseph Cordell www.amazon.com/Stupidest-Mistakes-Make-Facing-Divorce/dp/0307589803/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1459176921&sr=1-1&keywords=the+10+stupidest+mistakes+men+make+when+facing+divorce+and+how+to+avoid+themThis one is interesting. It's another good read if you feel as though you may be headed for the door. Sometimes it's advice is a bit contrary to the previous book though. This book is about looking out for your own interests. The previous one was about looking out for your kids interests. Sometimes those things may slightly contradict. For example, the previous book talks about custody in regards to what works best for kids (spoiler alert, 50/50 split is not always the best option for them). This book assumes that 50/50 custody is the goal because you, the father, won't miss out on their lives. Sounds good in theory and it sounds as though that approach would also benefit the kids, but there's evidence that 50/50 may NOT be best for the kids in certain situations. This particular book (the mistakes book) has good legal advice in it to protect your interests. It's written by an attorney though, and attorneys are paid to defend their clients, not necessarily the children of their clients. I'm not saying it's a bad book. It's actually quite wonderful. It has tons of great legal advice. I guess my point is, read this one AND the previous one, THEN create your own plan on how to proceed with both the future needs of you and your children in mind. Just my advice based on what I've read. The bad books... 1.) No More Mr. Nice Guy by Robert Glover www.amazon.com/No-More-Mr-Nice-Guy/dp/0762415339/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1459176253&sr=1-1&keywords=no+more+mr+nice+guyThis book actually has nuggets of gold in it. The bad part? Well, those nuggets are hidden deep within a quagmire of BS. The hard part is sorting out the BS from the gold. For that reason, I personally think this one is not worth the hassle. A lot of the advice is quite dangerous too if you ask me. It will also destroy your self esteem. The advice is delivered in such a rude way. Its counterproductive. This book has been recommended to me tons of times in marriage advice forums and I'm not sure why. It has a very selfish approach towards conflict. It's meant for those of us that neglect our own needs. The solution is apparently to go from making others too much of a priority to being a total selfish partner. If you are looking for the hail mary and have tried all other approaches, it may be worth a shot. Otherwise, don't waste your time or money. 2.) Any book on how to turn on your wife (read multiple) ... they are better suited as kindling in my situation. I can see how they are helpful for those that have never had much sense of romance. We all have different root causes. So, I'm not saying everyone should avoid these kinds of books. I'm just saying that in my particular situation, it was pointless. Many of the tips were things I wanted to do anyway but my wife has resisted any kind of romance. So for me? Pointless. Utterly pointless. The only good thing was trying it out and learning that it was pointless. So, I suppose it wasn't a waste of time for me. It just didn't pan out in my specific situation. 3.) Any book meant for my wife to read in order for her to find the reason for her low libido... also makes good kindling. I quickly realized that it was dumb to read such books. The only positive was getting a bit of compassion for my wife's point of view. Still, the fact that she wouldn't read these books unless I threatened divorce says a lot about how difficult it is for her to face this difficulty. Regardless, it's not my job to read such books. That's why I read about how to better myself and not her. She's responsible for her own mental health. All I can do is work on me. |
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