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Post by catlover on Apr 24, 2021 11:08:19 GMT -5
I am actually feeling happy(ish) today, I think you folks have helped me accept that it is never going to happen again in this marriage. At the same time, I am sad for the same reason. Talk about mixed feelings :-( Should I tell her this? I want to touch and be touched, if PIV sex doesn't happen I couldn't honestly care, I just want to feel skin on skin. FWIW, I have never touched her 'there' when she was sleeping, merely a hand on the butt would make the "figurative gates" slam shut, as if even the hint of something naughty repels her (that's what I think anyway), I've asked if I can hold her boob when we are going off to sleep and even that gets refused. 2 mchances of getting frisky. At times I do feel like just giving up “Merely a hand on the butt” Dude, that is intimate touching, and I would be bloody furious. Please do not underestimate the anguish this can cause women. “Merely a hand on the butt” to you could easily be distressing and degrading to a woman. I am uncertain if there is an equivalent for males. I have experienced unwanted and uninvited touch by a man and it was one of the most horrible experiences of my life. I advise you to reflect on my words very carefully. So, if you wouldn’t touch the lady next door, your granny, or any other woman on a specific part of her body, there’s a fair chance your W would like you to steer clear of this too. You must respect this, regardless of how much it frustrates you. Despite being your W she has every right to decline your touch. EVERYONE has this right and to breach it is unforgivable. Well I guess maybe I am just fucking desperate
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Post by jerri on Apr 24, 2021 19:20:41 GMT -5
I normally waken long before the wife. Time and time again I reach out and try to touch her in the good parts, only for the proverbial gates to slam shut. Then I feel all pissed, angry and resentful. I know what the outcome will be but I still try, maybe hoping she would get turned on. I have to remind myself she is very ill, in my mind though I think, “can’t she do one little thing for me”destructive cycle That is the exact same logic I used. If the average sex/lovemaking session is 8 minutes. Looks like they could give in several times a month.
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Post by mirrororchid on Apr 26, 2021 5:24:03 GMT -5
Despite being your W she has every right to decline your touch. EVERYONE has this right and to breach it is unforgivable. Well I guess maybe I am just fucking desperate Yeah, we get it. And desperation ain't pretty. Gotta stop. If that hurts a lot, it's your body telling you to change your situation. Somehow.
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Post by catlover on May 20, 2021 21:07:58 GMT -5
I realize now, after reading many similar posts, I guess I was hoping for some kind of positive reaction, which obviously is not forthcoming. Yearning for that physical affection (note, sex isn’t mentioned). Yearning for something that’s not going to happen
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Post by jerri on May 21, 2021 4:03:15 GMT -5
My H knew he was marrying a touchy feely type person and it doesn't just stop because the sex stopped. That's who I am.
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Post by shamwow on May 21, 2021 4:56:34 GMT -5
I am actually feeling happy(ish) today, I think you folks have helped me accept that it is never going to happen again in this marriage. At the same time, I am sad for the same reason. Talk about mixed feelings :-( Should I tell her this? I want to touch and be touched, if PIV sex doesn't happen I couldn't honestly care, I just want to feel skin on skin. FWIW, I have never touched her 'there' when she was sleeping, merely a hand on the butt would make the "figurative gates" slam shut, as if even the hint of something naughty repels her (that's what I think anyway), I've asked if I can hold her boob when we are going off to sleep and even that gets refused. 2 mchances of getting frisky. At times I do feel like just giving up “Merely a hand on the butt” Dude, that is intimate touching, and I would be bloody furious. Please do not underestimate the anguish this can cause women. “Merely a hand on the butt” to you could easily be distressing and degrading to a woman. I am uncertain if there is an equivalent for males. I have experienced unwanted and uninvited touch by a man and it was one of the most horrible experiences of my life. I advise you to reflect on my words very carefully. So, if you wouldn’t touch the lady next door, your granny, or any other woman on a specific part of her body, there’s a fair chance your W would like you to steer clear of this too. You must respect this, regardless of how much it frustrates you. Despite being your W she has every right to decline your touch. EVERYONE has this right and to breach it is unforgivable. I would be a bit more nuanced here. A hand on the butt of your wife is not tatamont to assualt. If you snuggle up to your spouse while sleeping, your arms have to go somewhere. It seems as though snuggling in the night is a no-go here. Hand IN her butt is quite different of course. Context is important here. Was this kind of snuggling once standard fare and is now being rebuffed? Was it always off the table? Was she the victim of some kind of abuse that this triggers memories of? The degree of offense here is contingent upon their situation. When I was married and in my SM, my ex would scoot away when I tried to cuddle in the night, even to the extreme of falling off the bed. Prior to marriage, no problem. I was confused as hell to say the least. Frustrated and angry as well. catlover is completely within his rights to want, need, and crave physical touch with the person who vowed before God and witnesses to have and hold, forsaking all others. Where I agree with you is on tactics... Dude, she isn't responding to being touched at night? Stop doing it. It isn't working. Doing so is just making her pissed and making you look a bit desparate. And desparate isn't sexy. Instead, when you are both awake, rested, and in a relatively good mood, have a frank conversation. Ask her exactly what about you she finds so distasteful. Remind her that marriage is the only relationship you are supposed to have physical intimate relations with another person. Ask her why this no longer works for her. Let her know that it is unacceptable without begging, whining, or issuing ultimatiums. You know...talk to her... And listen to what she says. If what you hear is that she wants you but wants you to approach it differently then try it her way and (quickly) evaluate if she is saying bullshit. If it's bullshit then you know what you're dealing with. Personally I suspect you'll get bullshit. Your options remain the same in that case... Stay, leave, cheat just as they always have been, but you are armed with a bit more info. If it is one of latter two, listen to baza and see a lawyer asap to see how things would shake out. In my case I left versus cheating... I wanted it all instead of sneaking around for a FWB or such, but that varies by individual and their situation. In the meantime, work on yourself. If you're not in shape, get in shape. Spend time with your kids. Pursue any interests / hobbies you may have. These are things you should be doing anyway. OK, typing this with a bit of insomnia... Going to roll over now, snuggle ballofconfusion, and rest my hand on her butt 😉
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Post by mirrororchid on May 21, 2021 6:05:35 GMT -5
I realize now, after reading many similar posts, I guess I was hoping for some kind of positive reaction, which obviously is not forthcoming. Yearning for that physical affection (note, sex isn’t mentioned). Yearning for something that’s not going to happen Segwaying from Shamwow, once bullshit is established. (unless you defy the odds.) In the REFUSED podcast, CSL's Addressing the Sexless Marriage series, he has some tactics to try. One I never did, but I think actually is fair game is removing your ring. The symbol is a lie if you are not united. “For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh.” What if they are no longer one flesh? Religious or not, that sentiment seems unanimous here. No nookie, no marriage. It's what marriage is for. Marriage is so much more than that! Well, sure. But it is that. Saving yourself for marriage? Saving what about yourself for marriage? Are you saving that part of yourself for marriage again, my sweet? You might be! Maybe it's time to stop saving so much and spend a little. CSL would never suggest this, but dating made Jerri's celibate husband go to the doc and get ED pills. Dating made my wife start initiating. Both of us told our spouses what we were doing. There was no "sneaking". Our spouses made our actions necessary. Refusers should be the ones needing to lie to everyone about what we do, not us. Do you want intimacy? Or do you want to have a successful marriage? Risking the latter may achieve the former. Just so long as you're aware it can blow apart. Shamwow's advice from Baza holds. How bad do you want an intimate relationship? Maybe not enough. Coming to grips with that reality is also a course charted by some members here. (Handy comes to mind as someone who has done well with that life choice.)
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