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Post by northstarmom on Mar 28, 2023 5:40:51 GMT -5
ariso:"I agree about his mental health. He has OCD and recieves medical treatment for that. When he was advised to go into theraphy, he went to one appointment and quit, claiming he doesn’t need it because everything is fine. Thank you for the advice! I do want to care more about myself, so I started picking up hobbies and going out with friends sometimes. I’ve tried online counseling for about two years but I was basically advised to just be patient."
Find another counselor. Your previous one's advice was awful. "Just be patient" would mean that you'll be stuck in the same situation forever. Since it looks like right now you're choosing to stay, a good counselor would be helping you figure out more ways to enrich your life even though you're staying. "Just be patient" is of no help at all. Your husband isn't going to change. At best, he'll stay the same. At worse, his OCD and other problematic behavior will get worse. Your sex life isn't going to improve with him as he thinks he is fine. The more you build a life in which you have friends and activities regardless of your husband's behavior, the happier you'll be.
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Post by starved4intimacy on Apr 20, 2023 14:05:47 GMT -5
 I have been married to the same women for 37 years. We co-parent two wonderful children. We travel together. We support each other when one of us is struggling. We have a strong bond of friendship. But for the past 20 years we have never had sex. Why? It sure was not my choice. Soon after giving birth to our second child my wife completely withdrew from me in the realm of sex, physical intimacy, and even simple physical gestures of affection. The most I ever get is a sad peck on the lips or cheek. I've tried to talk about but she quickly shuts down. We've gone into couples counseling twice, but my wife is not able to articulate what has motivated her sexual shutdown. I have a bunch of theories. Maybe she holding grudges over my past conduct she won't disclose. Maybe it's hormonal change. Maybe she dislikes and feels shame over how two pregnancies changed her body. I honestly don't know and probably will never know what's behind it. Why didn't I simply divorce her for the sake of sex. The biggest reason is my certainty this would have severely disrupted the lives of and permanently traumatized our kids. I consulted several different psychologists on this point and they all said my perception was accurate and I should stay. Another reason guilt. I have a strong sense that if I divorced my wife she would go into a severe depression, never date again, and be miserable. She has come very near saying this explicitly. The third reason is that my parents and my wife's parents were both married for 60 years before they died. So my thinking is that if I give up on my marriage it makes me a failure. Whether these thoughts are true or not, reasonable or not, these thoughts have held me in place. Emotionally this has not been easy. I am not just starved for sex, I am starved for simple human touch. I have more physical contact with our dog who loves it when I rub her belly or pat her on the head. At times I feel terribly alone. I even went through a serious depression that I have recovered from. I went onto a couple of paid websites looking for a sex-starved, touch-starved woman my age in a sexless marriage but neither site was helpful. One of the sites had divorced or widowed women seeking either a new husband or a lifetime partner. The other was for slutty women with their legs spread who looked like carriers of every STI I could name. I haven't given up, but I find myself shaking my head and sighing a lot. It may sound weird but just sharing my story made me feel a bit better as I wrote it.
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Post by heelots on Apr 20, 2023 16:56:27 GMT -5
 I have been married to the same women for 37 years. We co-parent two wonderful children. We travel together. We support each other when one of us is struggling. We have a strong bond of friendship. But for the past 20 years we have never had sex. Why? It sure was not my choice. Soon after giving birth to our second child my wife completely withdrew from me in the realm of sex, physical intimacy, and even simple physical gestures of affection. The most I ever get is a sad peck on the lips or cheek. I've tried to talk about but she quickly shuts down. We've gone into couples counseling twice, but my wife is not able to articulate what has motivated her sexual shutdown. I have a bunch of theories. Maybe she holding grudges over my past conduct she won't disclose. Maybe it's hormonal change. Maybe she dislikes and feels shame over how two pregnancies changed her body. I honestly don't know and probably will never know what's behind it. Why didn't I simply divorce her for the sake of sex. The biggest reason is my certainty this would have severely disrupted the lives of and permanently traumatized our kids. I consulted several different psychologists on this point and they all said my perception was accurate and I should stay. Another reason guilt. I have a strong sense that if I divorced my wife she would go into a severe depression, never date again, and be miserable. She has come very near saying this explicitly. The third reason is that my parents and my wife's parents were both married for 60 years before they died. So my thinking is that if I give up on my marriage it makes me a failure. Whether these thoughts are true or not, reasonable or not, these thoughts have held me in place. Emotionally this has not been easy. I am not just starved for sex, I am starved for simple human touch. I have more physical contact with our dog who loves it when I rub her belly or pat her on the head. At times I feel terribly alone. I even went through a serious depression that I have recovered from. I went onto a couple of paid websites looking for a sex-starved, touch-starved woman my age in a sexless marriage but neither site was helpful. One of the sites had divorced or widowed women seeking either a new husband or a lifetime partner. The other was for slutty women with their legs spread who looked like carriers of every STI I could name. I haven't given up, but I find myself shaking my head and sighing a lot. It may sound weird but just sharing my story made me feel a bit better as I wrote it. If the kids are grown and gone it might be time for you to call it quits with your roommate if you can stand the financial hit you will take divorcing her.
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Post by angeleyes65 on Apr 20, 2023 20:01:17 GMT -5
angeleyes65Sorry for the late reply. I felt embarrassed and ashamed after writing here, I don’t know why… I agree about his mental health. He has OCD and recieves medical treatment for that. When he was advised to go into theraphy, he went to one appointment and quit, claiming he doesn’t need it because everything is fine. Thank you for the advice! I do want to care more about myself, so I started picking up hobbies and going out with friends sometimes. I’ve tried online counseling for about two years but I was basically advised to just be patient. No reason to be embarrassed. I'm glad you are taking care of you. Sorry about the bad advice. Doesn't really sound like they were putting your interest first. I needed counseling to deal with guilt of putting myself first and leaving someone I knew wouldn't cope well. He didn't and still isn't 5 yrs later. But I don't take ownership of his issues.
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Post by angeleyes65 on Apr 20, 2023 20:37:45 GMT -5
@ starved4intimacy welcome . Lots of simularities in our stories. Married 34 yrs 15 sexless. 2 kids stayed until they were raised. Stayed because of his depression and worried about how he would cope. Also did the paid sites but had success. Now divorced in a wonderful relationship. You are right it's not just the sex. I hope you can find happiness and human affection. It's hard on the soul living without it.
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Post by mirrororchid on Apr 21, 2023 6:16:16 GMT -5
I honestly don't know and probably will never know what's behind it.... I have a strong sense that if I divorced my wife she would go into a severe depression, never date again, and be miserable. She has come very near saying this explicitly. The third reason is that my parents and my wife's parents were both married for 60 years before they died. So my thinking is that if I give up on my marriage it makes me a failure. It may sound weird but just sharing my story made me feel a bit better as I wrote it. You say you're probably never going to know. Are you ready to stop trying to figure it out? If so, that lands you where everyone LIASM ends up. The three options: Divorce Outsource Stay and learn to cope with celibacy. Long story short, available elsewhere here on ILIASM, if curious:Like you, when my clinically-depressed wife and I were down to 5 times a year for the third year straight (or more?), I fired up a dating profile on OKcupid seeking only married women (polyamorous) and confirmed there was interest if I was on the market as a married man. They had a home life they didn't want to leave. So did I. That was the plan. Stay married, get that missing piece elsewhere. I explained to my wife I'd be taking a lover in two months if something didn't change. I was going to be intimate with someone. It'd be great if it was her, but it wasn't going to be nobody. She reset, November 2019. We clock in around 17 times a year, every three weeks. Not zesty, exactly, but I appreciate the compromise and the times we do have are really quite good.
This plan meant that she would have to be the one destroying the family, not me. She would have been choosing forced celibacy over the family/marriage. That's not a good look and it was one I found acceptable as a chapter of my life story had she decided to do something so non-sensical/unreasonable/controlling/sadistic. Both our parents were married 'til death too. You and I have lots of overlap. Just venting makes you feel good? You don't say. Glad to be here to listen.
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Post by blunder8 on Apr 21, 2023 15:30:57 GMT -5
 I have been married to the same women for 37 years. We co-parent two wonderful children. We travel together. We support each other when one of us is struggling. We have a strong bond of friendship. But for the past 20 years we have never had sex. Why? It sure was not my choice. Soon after giving birth to our second child my wife completely withdrew from me in the realm of sex, physical intimacy, and even simple physical gestures of affection. The most I ever get is a sad peck on the lips or cheek. I've tried to talk about but she quickly shuts down. We've gone into couples counseling twice, but my wife is not able to articulate what has motivated her sexual shutdown. I have a bunch of theories. Maybe she holding grudges over my past conduct she won't disclose. Maybe it's hormonal change. Maybe she dislikes and feels shame over how two pregnancies changed her body. I honestly don't know and probably will never know what's behind it. Why didn't I simply divorce her for the sake of sex. The biggest reason is my certainty this would have severely disrupted the lives of and permanently traumatized our kids. I consulted several different psychologists on this point and they all said my perception was accurate and I should stay. Another reason guilt. I have a strong sense that if I divorced my wife she would go into a severe depression, never date again, and be miserable. She has come very near saying this explicitly. The third reason is that my parents and my wife's parents were both married for 60 years before they died. So my thinking is that if I give up on my marriage it makes me a failure. Whether these thoughts are true or not, reasonable or not, these thoughts have held me in place. Emotionally this has not been easy. I am not just starved for sex, I am starved for simple human touch. I have more physical contact with our dog who loves it when I rub her belly or pat her on the head. At times I feel terribly alone. I even went through a serious depression that I have recovered from. I went onto a couple of paid websites looking for a sex-starved, touch-starved woman my age in a sexless marriage but neither site was helpful. One of the sites had divorced or widowed women seeking either a new husband or a lifetime partner. The other was for slutty women with their legs spread who looked like carriers of every STI I could name. I haven't given up, but I find myself shaking my head and sighing a lot. It may sound weird but just sharing my story made me feel a bit better as I wrote it. Your story is my story. Very similar down to the hunting sex online and realizing the futility of it. As you have found it is comforting just telling the story and realizing there are many members of this unfortunate club. I hope you find strength and wisdom from interacting with others here.
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Post by vanessa55 on May 3, 2023 19:09:24 GMT -5
Hello,
I am 38 and I have been married to my H for almost 13y now and have had problems with intimacy since the beginning of our marriage. I thought I was something with me because I could not understand how a young couple, recently married, did not have sex frequently. He used to say he was tired, and if I asked any questions about it, he would make me feel bad / guilty for asking. The years went by, and, of course, things got worse... I have no idea how long it's been since we've had sex. The thing is, it is not only about lack of intimacy and emotional neglect anymore, it is about the marriage has become. We are way too distant now and, I honestly don't think am will ever get better, but I don't have the courage or the strength to leave.
In one of our talks he said he had been in a sexless relationship before, but he only admitted to that 1y ago. It feels like I am never going to happy again. I know it's a stupid thing to say, but that is exactly how I feel.
I am sorry for such a long intro... it has been a hard day...
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Post by angeleyes65 on May 3, 2023 19:34:05 GMT -5
vanessa55 Welcome and don't be sorry, we want to hear your story. I too thought I would never have the strength to leave but I did it. Did I stay longer than I should have, yes way longer. Once I was out I regretted all the time I wasted. But I'm so glad I'm out. Start replacing the things you are missing with friends and fun,hobbies , self improvement. Don't let him control your happiness. Make an exit plan and work it. Could be a 6 month plan or 6 year plan. My plan was to get my kids through highschool and pay debt off, get a better job. And while I was doing that I reclaimed my life and happiness. I put me first. It went off the rails when I got to the end of my plan and couldn't pull the trigger so I stayed a couple more years. The thought that I wouldn't get out weighed on me. So I just made myself do it. I went to counseling once I got out but I should have done it before it would have helped me pull the trigger. It is never too late to be happy. I'm turning 58 I left 6 years ago next month..
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Post by vanessa55 on May 3, 2023 19:55:43 GMT -5
vanessa55 Welcome and don't be sorry, we want to hear your story. I too thought I would never have the strength to leave but I did it. Did I stay longer than I should have, yes way longer. Once I was out I regretted all the time I wasted. But I'm so glad I'm out. Start replacing the things you are missing with friends and fun,hobbies , self improvement. Don't let him control your happiness. Make an exit plan and work it. Could be a 6 month plan or 6 year plan. My plan was to get my kids through highschool and pay debt off, get a better job. And while I was doing that I reclaimed my life and happiness. I put me first. It went off the rails when I got to the end of my plan and couldn't pull the trigger so I stayed a couple more years. The thought that I wouldn't get out weighed on me. So I just made myself do it. I went to counseling once I got out but I should have done it before it would have helped me pull the trigger. It is never too late to be happy. I'm turning 58 I left 6 years ago next month.. Thank you, I would also like to wait for my kids to leave the house, but my youngest is only 3... I am now doing counseling. Now, the other thing is, Since he also told me he had been contemplating to file for divorce, it feels like I might not have time to get myself together before it happens. Every time that there is an argument I feel like, " this is it, he is going to say the words". The lack of intimacy and the neglect was only the start. Now the whole house is on fire.
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Post by angeleyes65 on May 3, 2023 20:09:46 GMT -5
vanessa55 Welcome and don't be sorry, we want to hear your story. I too thought I would never have the strength to leave but I did it. Did I stay longer than I should have, yes way longer. Once I was out I regretted all the time I wasted. But I'm so glad I'm out. Start replacing the things you are missing with friends and fun,hobbies , self improvement. Don't let him control your happiness. Make an exit plan and work it. Could be a 6 month plan or 6 year plan. My plan was to get my kids through highschool and pay debt off, get a better job. And while I was doing that I reclaimed my life and happiness. I put me first. It went off the rails when I got to the end of my plan and couldn't pull the trigger so I stayed a couple more years. The thought that I wouldn't get out weighed on me. So I just made myself do it. I went to counseling once I got out but I should have done it before it would have helped me pull the trigger. It is never too late to be happy. I'm turning 58 I left 6 years ago next month.. Thank you, I would also like to wait for my kids to leave the house, but my youngest is only 3... I am now doing counseling. Now, the other thing is, Since he also told me he had been contemplating to file for divorce, it feels like I might not have time to get myself together before it happens. Every time that there is an argument I feel like, " this is it, he is going to say the words". The lack of intimacy and the neglect was only the start. Now the whole house is on fire. In that case first thing is to take financial inventory get copies of everything take them to work give to friend or family member so they don't disappear. Keep a eye on everything going in and out. Credit cards.. contact a lawyer and get a consultation . Honestly if for kids are that young I would not try to stay until they are out of school that is a long time to be miserable but that being said I stayed 9 yrs after I knew it was done
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Post by vanessa55 on May 3, 2023 21:38:46 GMT -5
Thank you, I would also like to wait for my kids to leave the house, but my youngest is only 3... I am now doing counseling. Now, the other thing is, Since he also told me he had been contemplating to file for divorce, it feels like I might not have time to get myself together before it happens. Every time that there is an argument I feel like, " this is it, he is going to say the words". The lack of intimacy and the neglect was only the start. Now the whole house is on fire. In that case first thing is to take financial inventory get copies of everything take them to work give to friend or family member so they don't disappear. Keep a eye on everything going in and out. Credit cards.. contact a lawyer and get a consultation . Honestly if for kids are that young I would not try to stay until they are out of school that is a long time to be miserable but that being said I stayed 9 yrs after I knew it was done Thank you for your advice.
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Post by baza on May 3, 2023 22:22:15 GMT -5
Quoting you here Sister vanessa55 - "but I don't have the courage or the strength to leave" You don't need some extraordinary levels of courage or strength to start your journey out. But what you DO need is a do-able exit strategy in your pocket that you could activate should you wish to do so. And you can construct this plan yourself. Suggestion(s) - see a lawyer in your jurisdiction to establish - theoretically - how a divorce would shhake out for you. - within that framework start putting together your - theoretical - exit strategy, addressing things like shoring up your support network. - if relevant research everything you can find about shepherding any minor children through such a - thepretical -process. None of this commits you to anything, it is just you gathering information that any married person needs to know. Whether you activate your exit plan or not is entirely down to you, but the point is that YOU can construct the plan, and that opens up your options a bit. You "could" get out - if you have a plan to do so. Good luck with all this Sister @vanessa , it is hard work you have ahead of you.
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Post by mirrororchid on May 4, 2023 6:07:04 GMT -5
I am 38 and I have been married to my H for almost 13y now and have had problems with intimacy since the beginning of our marriage. I thought I was something with me because I could not understand how a young couple, recently married, did not have sex frequently. He used to say he was tired, and if I asked any questions about it, he would make me feel bad / guilty for asking. The years went by, and, of course, things got worse... I have no idea how long it's been since we've had sex. The thing is, it is not only about lack of intimacy and emotional neglect anymore, it is about the marriage has become. We are way too distant now and, I honestly don't think am will ever get better, but I don't have the courage or the strength to leave. In one of our talks he said he had been in a sexless relationship before, but he only admitted to that 1y ago. It feels like I am never going to happy again. I know it's a stupid thing to say, but that is exactly how I feel....
I would also like to wait for my kids to leave the house, but my youngest is only 3... Since he also told me he had been contemplating to file for divorce, it feels like I might not have time to get myself together before it happens. Every time that there is an argument I feel like, " this is it, he is going to say the words". The lack of intimacy and the neglect was only the start. Now the whole house is on fire. While preparing for divorce isn't a bad thing, (it can be invigorating to have the exit plan ready, even if you choose not to take it), your situation is slightly different to more common scenarios and there may be more options to mull over. He has raised the option of divorce, you're open to the idea of leaving. Neither of you seems to have screamed it in anger (not that you've said.) A rational discussion about negotiating your relationship may be possible. What purpose does divorce serve for him? So far, you seem to say it allows you to seek a close companionship with someone else, having attempted to forge a stronger bond with your husband and hitting brick walls. Are there other reasons to skedaddle? "Never going to be happy again"? Stupid thing to say? Sad, definitely. Stupid? Hardly. You feel what you feel. It's subjective and it's not stupid to not want to feel as though it's permanent. That kind of life is what prison is for. The grind and muddling through is super common. In some cases it never gets bad enough to leave. Some are stuck for practical reasons, often financial. Some questions for you:
What are the arguments about? The relationship, everyday life? Just bickering about everything? Do you have an idea whether your husband may have outlets? An affair? Extensive use of porn and "self-love"? Do you think it possible to agree to live in the house with him platonically as co-parents even if you did divorce? Kind of like " bird-nesting" but separate rooms instead of an apartment. Deliberately living sexless rather than intending for it to change (this would be you.) If he plans to stay celibate, and he's been in a sexless relationship before, staying married in this one may be as good as it gets and he lives with his kids. Maybe that's important to him. It may be the reason he doesn't divorce. If that path is easy, why go through with it? He doesn't want sex, he says. Too tired. Or...whatever. (you may hear about "why chasing" if you wander around ILIASM for long) Is he dead set against the idea of you getting intimate companionship elsewhere? Does he insist you be celibate or he'll torch the marriage and family home? Or perhaps you cannot see yourself living apart from your lover. (some ILIASM members are in that school. They need the whole package.) Extramarital love can endanger the family home, even if you negotiated the arrangement; the heart is sometimes unwilling to stay in the passenger seat, despite being pass-out drunk.
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Post by vanessa55 on May 8, 2023 13:15:20 GMT -5
I am 38 and I have been married to my H for almost 13y now and have had problems with intimacy since the beginning of our marriage. I thought I was something with me because I could not understand how a young couple, recently married, did not have sex frequently. He used to say he was tired, and if I asked any questions about it, he would make me feel bad / guilty for asking. The years went by, and, of course, things got worse... I have no idea how long it's been since we've had sex. The thing is, it is not only about lack of intimacy and emotional neglect anymore, it is about the marriage has become. We are way too distant now and, I honestly don't think am will ever get better, but I don't have the courage or the strength to leave. In one of our talks he said he had been in a sexless relationship before, but he only admitted to that 1y ago. It feels like I am never going to happy again. I know it's a stupid thing to say, but that is exactly how I feel....
I would also like to wait for my kids to leave the house, but my youngest is only 3... Since he also told me he had been contemplating to file for divorce, it feels like I might not have time to get myself together before it happens. Every time that there is an argument I feel like, " this is it, he is going to say the words". The lack of intimacy and the neglect was only the start. Now the whole house is on fire. While preparing for divorce isn't a bad thing, (it can be invigorating to have the exit plan ready, even if you choose not to take it), your situation is slightly different to more common scenarios and there may be more options to mull over. He has raised the option of divorce, you're open to the idea of leaving. Neither of you seems to have screamed it in anger (not that you've said.) A rational discussion about negotiating your relationship may be possible. What purpose does divorce serve for him? So far, you seem to say it allows you to seek a close companionship with someone else, having attempted to forge a stronger bond with your husband and hitting brick walls. Are there other reasons to skedaddle? "Never going to be happy again"? Stupid thing to say? Sad, definitely. Stupid? Hardly. You feel what you feel. It's subjective and it's not stupid to not want to feel as though it's permanent. That kind of life is what prison is for. The grind and muddling through is super common. In some cases it never gets bad enough to leave. Some are stuck for practical reasons, often financial. Some questions for you:
What are the arguments about? The relationship, everyday life? Just bickering about everything? Do you have an idea whether your husband may have outlets? An affair? Extensive use of porn and "self-love"? Do you think it possible to agree to live in the house with him platonically as co-parents even if you did divorce? Kind of like " bird-nesting" but separate rooms instead of an apartment. Deliberately living sexless rather than intending for it to change (this would be you.) If he plans to stay celibate, and he's been in a sexless relationship before, staying married in this one may be as good as it gets and he lives with his kids. Maybe that's important to him. It may be the reason he doesn't divorce. If that path is easy, why go through with it? He doesn't want sex, he says. Too tired. Or...whatever. (you may hear about "why chasing" if you wander around ILIASM for long) Is he dead set against the idea of you getting intimate companionship elsewhere? Does he insist you be celibate or he'll torch the marriage and family home? Or perhaps you cannot see yourself living apart from your lover. (some ILIASM members are in that school. They need the whole package.) Extramarital love can endanger the family home, even if you negotiated the arrangement; the heart is sometimes unwilling to stay in the passenger seat, despite being pass-out drunk. I was finally able to stop to answer all the questions and try to think about it. So here I go. The reason to skedaddle would be my feelings for him and also my kids... at times the relationship seems nice, even though it can take a turn out of nowhere and feel terrible. Th4 part you said that it does not get bad enough to leave makes sense to me, and yes, money. The arguments are often about him wanting me to plan things for the family or how "my mood affects everyone amd I make everyone miserable". We are also in the process of a move and both really stressed. Still, we have been in this cycle for a while. I dont think he has an affair. I know he watches porn but idk how often. (Do you think it possible to agree to live in the house with him platonically as co-parents even if you did divorce?) I Don't think this would be possible. (Deliberately living sexless rather than intending for it to change (this would be you.)) This os kind of how I live now. I know this is not going to change. (If he plans to stay celibate, and he's been in a sexless relationship before, staying married in this one may be as good as it gets and he lives with his kids. Maybe that's important to him. It may be the reason he doesn't divorce. If that path is easy, why go through with it? ) great point, never thought about it this way. (He doesn't want sex, he says. Too tired.) He makes it alot about me, but I don't buy it anymore. (Is he dead set against the idea of you getting intimate companionship elsewhere? Does he insist you be celibate or he'll torch the marriage and family home?) We have never talked about it seriously, but I honestly would not want to live this way. I have no idea of how I feel at times... this has destroyed my self esteem and left me resentful. Last time we talked about it ,it just made feel like he thinks that he is waaay better than me.
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