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Post by Handy on Jan 20, 2021 0:51:17 GMT -5
Supposedly good people doing bad things
Zimbardo- Stanford Prison Experiment Documentary
The Milgram Experiment 1962 Full Documentary
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Post by mirrororchid on Jan 20, 2021 8:09:40 GMT -5
Supposedly good people doing bad things The Milgram Experiment 1962 Full Documentary Didn't watch your video. Did it include the refusal of subjects to continue shocking when order to do so rather than emphasizing the importance of science? If not, you may want to see this lesser known evidence that people are less monstrous than we've been led to believe by the Milgram experiment: www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/radiolab/episodes/180092-the-bad-showQueue to 10:33 if you're short on time.
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Post by Handy on Jan 20, 2021 12:41:43 GMT -5
I listened to part of the podcast (10:33 an on some). Shocking!
The march on the capitol was also part of the theory of group think and mob mentality we have seen in various riots in cities across the USA and other countries, burning parts of cities and businesses that had no part in the original issues that were supposedly central to the protest.
Having supporters around a person, enforces what they stand for is powerful and motivates some people to continue to be disruptive. I even saw this happen with kids in the group home where I worked for a couple of years. One decent kid became disruptive when accompanied by another group-home resident. It was a pattern repeated many, many times. We even had a rule that when a resident went to some places he had to go alone.
Even the Mormons and Jehovah Witness go out in pairs to encourage each other.
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Post by jerri on Jan 21, 2021 0:46:23 GMT -5
Supposedly good people doing bad things The Milgram Experiment 1962 Full Documentary Didn't watch your video. Did it include the refusal of subjects to continue shocking when order to do so rather than emphasizing the importance of science? If not, you may want to see this lesser known evidence that people are less monstrous than we've been led to believe by the Milgram experiment: www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/radiolab/episodes/180092-the-bad-showQueue to 10:33 if you're short on time. Was crazy! Suffered too long not knowing if they had died. Amazing what people will do. SHOCKING! Then they would not follow orders to shock! Best Part! Thanks Handy watching the second one now. the first one was wild. Made me wonder what people are capable of. OK, dejavu
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Post by worksforme2 on Jan 21, 2021 9:05:01 GMT -5
Reading these reminders of what people are capable of doing holds no surprises for me. One need only remember the soviet gulags, the Chinese re-education camps to name just a couple. Here in the U.S. there are numerous examples of seemingly normal people doing despicable things daily. One that comes to mind is the Judge Rotenberg Educational center that was recently ordered to stop EST on its mentally and emotionally handicapped residents, a practice that had been in place for 49 years, in spite of being condemned by the UN and other organizations as torture. Now we are seeing the calls coming forth from members of the liberal establishment and the MSM in the U.S. to ostracize and punish conservatives and those who voted for or supported Trump. Some liberal members of the government are calling for re-education centers for conservatives to deprogram them from their dangerous beliefs regarding what constitutes freedom or speech or thought. Some liberal MSM are asking that conservative media be de-platformed so that only progressive ideas can be allowed. Is it really surprising that guns and ammo is being purchased like there is no tomorrow? We will see if Biden can keep the members of his party who foster these ideas under his control or if troops will increasingly become a fixture in the democrats political platform and to what extent "boots on the ground" will become an acceptable means of governing.
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Post by northstarmom on Jan 21, 2021 17:41:30 GMT -5
"Some liberal members of the government are calling for re-education centers for conservatives to deprogram them from their dangerous beliefs regarding what constitutes freedom or speech or thought. Some liberal MSM are asking that conservative media be de-platformed so that only progressive ideas can be allowed."
The problem with some conservative media is that it deliberately promulgated lies such as the lies spread by QAnon, an organization that believes that Satan-worshipping, cannibalistic pedophiles. Some high elected officials also spread those lies, lies that encouraged adherents to break into the US Capitol. The beliefs are false and dangerous to individuals as well as society in general. Spreading such lies should not be considered a "right" any more than would be falsely shouting "fire" in a movie theater.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2021 16:12:40 GMT -5
I'm not a publicly political guy, I tend to understand where most people are coming from except at the crazy fringes. I think the US has drawn a line in the sand concerning the First Amendment in the right place, the Brandenburg standard for incitement. I watched a documentary on Ira Glasser, long time Executive Director of the ACLU, and his take on the First Amendment was interesting. I'll paraphrase but he said that it took him a long time to be ok with the right to free speech because there's no getting around that one person's freedom of expression is another person's hate speech and that it's largely in the opinion of the listener. I'm fine with leaving that line where it is.
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Post by mirrororchid on Jan 26, 2021 20:00:32 GMT -5
Now we are seeing the calls coming forth from members of the liberal establishment and the MSM in the U.S. to ostracize and punish conservatives and those who voted for or supported Trump. Some liberal members of the government are calling for re-education centers for conservatives to deprogram them from their dangerous beliefs regarding what constitutes freedom or speech or thought. Some liberal MSM are asking that conservative media be de-platformed so that only progressive ideas can be allowed. Is it really surprising that guns and ammo is being purchased like there is no tomorrow? Have you met any of these liberals? I know of none that match your description. There was a similar report about "Jade Helm" that was all the rage in conservative media. Do you remember this? More concentration camps for conservatives then too. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jade_Helm_15_conspiracy_theories#Conspiracy_theoriesThis story was wetting pants nationwide for a month or so, then.... nothing. People must enjoy being sent into a wild panic fits. They do it a lot. As for all teh gun buying...is it liberals buying the guns? If not, how do the liberals plan to get the conservatives locked up? The stark fear of Antifa has me mystified. Again, are liberals a well armed bloodthirsty horde? Not last I checked. Those who fancy themselves left-wing champions, I need to get a memo out to them. You're it. There are no reinforcements. Once the right wingers take you out, there's no second wave. Liberals attack like Ghandi, and MLK. We just whine and complain and get beat up, until the other side gets tired. If a few think the left can fight fire with fire, I'll tend to their wounds and express my sympathies for their having strayed from the left wing philosophy. We're wimps. It's worked for us. We're sticking with it. Now the concern is National Guard troops in Washington guarding teh capitol while they consider legally barring from public office the guy who caused an armed invasion of eh very place they're meeting? If they are around for more than a couple weeks after the impeachment concludes, I'll have another look. For now, I find it absurd, but rather logical. It used to be liberals were accused of being limp-wristed wimpy sissies. Now we're dire threats to all good Christians everywhere. If I wait some more, maybe y'all will relax again and hate us in a less scary manner. So far, conservatives are content to watch the left warily, poised to strike with their abundant firearms if the libs make a single false move. The left just looks on with concern wondering what happens if they decide to instead take precautions and gun down those they suspect, not waiting for proof of a threat.
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Post by ironhamster on Feb 5, 2021 20:33:57 GMT -5
Think of the gladiators and all those poeple who wanted to see violence. Barbaric! I live in Portland. We had 165 nights straight of leftist violence. At this point, I am not particularly affected by spicy air, because tear gas and OC vapors have been so common. Antifa are primarily rich kids. They show up and they don't go away because they don't need to work for a living. They don't understand things like insurance doesn't cover every loss, or that Lincoln was a civil rights leader, and I have no idea why they destroyed the beloved moose statue, but, all that aside, I have become desensitized to the street violence. I HAVE to be desensitized to it, because there's not anything I can do to change the Dunning Kruger mindset of the people around me, and it doesn't make any sense to be upset about things I cannot change. This flipped on January 6. I was there. By the time I got to the Capitol, everything was in motion, so there wasn't much I could do but sit back and watch. The irony was not lost on me that the same people that supported the attack on the Supreme Court, the same people encouraging the burning, looting, assaulting, and murdering, were now under siege by people they likely expected to just eat their shit sandwich. Throughout the day, I helped one police officer that was dragged into the crowd to safety and tended to a woman that was trampled, and likely had a broken hip or femur. I was there until 6, when the grand finale of flashbangs and tear gas were actually debilitating, and the yellow vested Capitol Hill police backed up by Virginia CHPs took the steps. All this is politicized. Officer Sicknick was not hit by a fire extinguisher. He died of medical complications rumored to be a stroke, but he was not in the group that the fire extinguisher was thrown at. The excessive use of force on both sides was appalling. I saw lumber scraps from the construction thrown at the cops. I saw indiscriminate use of rubber bullets. Ashli had no weapons, and the officer that shot her in the neck still has not been identified, nor will he be charged, which are just more evidence that Trump supporters are legally lower on the social justice scale than farm animals. Anyhow, getting to the point, we are being forced by the complacency of the left to get used to this barbarism. BLM is run by a woman that successfully bombed the Capitol in 1983. Obama started his political career in the parler of two convicted terrorist bombers. This spiral into barbarism is just a logical societal step in leftist ideology, as I see it.
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Post by petrushka on Feb 5, 2021 22:46:48 GMT -5
What's the KoolAid taste like?
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Post by ironhamster on Feb 5, 2021 23:17:35 GMT -5
What's the KoolAid taste like? I don't know. One thing I will say is a lot of people don't even know they drink it. Antifa claims to be opposed to fascism. Anti-fascism and anti-racism are koolaid terms. The belief is, they are opposed to something bad, and therefore anyone not following THEIR anti-fascist definition or anti-racist definition is therefore automatically fascist or racist. This is quite the Dunning Kruger problem. In Seattle's CHOP, we had about 5000 participants over three weeks, and two murders. Do the math. Annualized, the CHOP murder rate was twenty times any American murder capital. All murder victims and surviving shooting victims were black, which is a statistical anomaly showing the leftist racism plain as day. CHOP was literally insurrection, taking part of America by force away from America. Facts fuck feelings.
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Post by saarinista on Feb 5, 2021 23:22:37 GMT -5
CHOP? Sorry what is that?
I am not an advocate of violence or threatening law enforcement.
No one should surge past police lines into a secure government facility.
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Post by Handy on Feb 5, 2021 23:37:40 GMT -5
CHOP=Seattle Capitol Hill Occupied Protest
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Post by ironhamster on Feb 5, 2021 23:48:12 GMT -5
CHOP? Sorry what is that? I am not an advocate of violence or threatening law enforcement. No one should surge past police lines into a secure government facility. My city endured 165 nights straight of organized threats to law enforcement, all at the urging of leftist leaders like Nancy Pelosi and AOC.
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Post by saarinista on Feb 6, 2021 0:04:52 GMT -5
Well, I'm a huge fan of Nancy Pelosi. AOC is a bit of a new kid rock star, but I think she means well. I didn't hear them advocating for violence or property destruction, however.
My time advocating for a better post pandemic America was spent tagging a few photos online of the BLM walk which came past my house, and making phone calls to get out the vote for Joe Biden.
I think we're better off talking and voting than even peaceful marches with placards. Unfortunately, too many opinionated people in the same place can turn into pushing, shoving and flat out violence way too easily.
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