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Post by atlantic on Dec 6, 2021 23:36:35 GMT -5
Lying here after being denied intimacy again. My first post and realize how impossible it is to continue like this. She is too tired at night, too busy during the day, and working out in the morning. Almost 20 years of so little intimacy. We both are attractive but why must we torture ourselves like this.
So desire to take my time and be intimate and find myself fantasying about it whenever I see a woman walking alone. Wondering if there are others who are suffering in the same way. This is so unnecessary. I know I can’t keep going like this as there is no substitute for touch. Food, drink, the Internet, work, no…. None of it can replace the need for touch and to touch. Not even looking for answers, just need to make sure someone, anyone, knows how much I’m suffering. Thank you for reading.
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Post by baza on Dec 7, 2021 0:15:55 GMT -5
Any amount of members here know how much you are suffering Brother atlantic . Reading extensively in here can be helpful. |
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Post by ironhamster on Dec 7, 2021 1:34:01 GMT -5
Lying here after being denied intimacy again. My first post and realize how impossible it is to continue like this. She is too tired at night, too busy during the day, and working out in the morning. Almost 20 years of so little intimacy. We both are attractive but why must we torture ourselves like this. So desire to take my time and be intimate and find myself fantasying about it whenever I see a woman walking alone. Wondering if there are others who are suffering in the same way. This is so unnecessary. I know I can’t keep going like this as there is no substitute for touch. Food, drink, the Internet, work, no…. None of it can replace the need for touch and to touch. Not even looking for answers, just need to make sure someone, anyone, knows how much I’m suffering. Thank you for reading. I can confirm what baza says. If she wanted something, she would make it a priority. Wouldn't she? |
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Post by mirrororchid on Dec 7, 2021 5:13:14 GMT -5
She is too tired at night, too busy during the day, and working out in the morning. ...why must we torture ourselves like this. Welcome, Atlantic. Sorry you're here. If it were actually torture, wouldn't she skip a workout to stop it? I'm a bit concerned it's not quite as bad for her. Many ILIASM members puzzle about why it seems so easy for refusing spouses to go for lengthy durations without intimacy. My wife, bless her, was also confused by it and didn't like her indifference. (Mind you, she didn't do anything about it for over four years.) Some of what may happen here is an achievement of clarity as to what your situation actually is, what your feelings actually are, and why sexlessness may be happening (individual people's "why" may be an unanswered mystery forever, so brace yourself for a bit of frustration there.) but the better part is the coalescing of a decision process that brings you to the inevitable three choices: Stay, Outsource, Leave. Poke around even a little and you'll hit threads that go into detail. A first question, if you're up for it is: "Why don't you leave?" (This question is not a recommendation you do so or encouragement. It is an objective inquiry. e.g. religious belief, societal judgment, financial strain, breaking my kids' home, etc.) |
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Post by atlantic on Dec 7, 2021 9:45:46 GMT -5
"If it were actually torture, wouldn't she skip a workout to stop it?"
You are right. It's likely not torture for her or she has another outlet.
"Why don't you leave?"
I actually did at one point, not related directly to sexless marriage, but due to her communicating with an old boyfriend and then misleading me as I recovered from the trauma (long story there). I dug as hard as I could and could never find any proof of physical infidelity. Anytime I felt she was going to cheat, I had it so closely monitored I would know and she hasn't.
She has no issue with long spells with no intimacy with me. Thinking maybe she never thought I was attractive in the first place and married because I was a Christian who showered her with attention.
We got back together again because I sensed she was committed to the marriage and quite frankly I think both of us couldn't stand seeing what the separation was doing to our children who are quite young.
The reality is that from Day 1 of the marriage it has been a challenge. I remember telling a counselor in Year 1 of the marriage I think my wife must have been sexually abused because she is so stiff and doesn't seem to relax when we are intimate. I never asked my wife, as I never wanted to insult her stiffness in bed.
I have faith that God will resolve this, somehow, but I don't know how. Maybe that means He resolves it by making me stronger. I just know I'm suffering and at a point where I at least need to reach out via an anonymous forum. At least so someone understands.
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Post by ironhamster on Dec 7, 2021 10:23:17 GMT -5
atlantic, you may want to do some research on asexuality. Asexuality is an overlooked sexual orientation. Just like straight people have no interest in people of the same sex, asexual people don't have any sexual interest in anyone. This means, through no fault of their own, they are destined to be a sexual disappointment to anyone in any relationship where sex is to be expected. My ex never would admit she wasn't sexually attracted to me, but she had twenty-three years of avoidance. The only times she wanted sex were situations such as the need to get married or the need to have children. I hope that helps.
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Post by Apocrypha on Dec 7, 2021 12:33:34 GMT -5
Almost 20 years of so little intimacy. [...] Wondering if there are others who are suffering in the same way. This is so unnecessary. I know I can’t keep going like this [...] just need to make sure someone, anyone, knows how much I’m suffering. Sometimes you just need to send a message out in a bottle to the universe. Lots of people are here to receive it. You are correct. It is unnecessary for you to be without touch in your life, though it might be necessary that you are without touch in this relationship with that person.)\ It's hard - likely on both of you. You probably you have let her know how much you are suffering. This has not changed the result. Now you are letting other's know and seeking affinity. This is a common problem and you will find many similar stories. But, these will not change the result. Only one person can be depended on to create the best opportunity to change the result. You said almost 20 years - that's a lot to handle! Was it the whole marriage? When did it begin? Did it start when you got married? A child? Buying a house? Before then? I am curious - Was there a before and an after? In the before-time, did you ever have a mutual expectation of sexual expression? |
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Post by atlantic on Dec 8, 2021 12:59:54 GMT -5
Was it the whole marriage? Yes. From the honeymoon (we made love the first night only, no imtimacy after that point) on, she has been hesitant and not "free" or "relaxed" with sex.
When did it begin? From the start. I thought because we were Christians once we got married she should be into it.
The frustrating thing is that I once found lingerie she had (held on to) from before the marriage. She has NEVER worn lingerie for me, not even on our honeymoon. So, she was vulnerable and sexy for other men (man?) but not me. That is absolutely frustrating.
I've told her in the past I feel like I'm a resource being used up. I sincerely feel she is just using me. She doesn't work, she doesn't keep the house up that's appropriate. If we had intimacy, I would overlook all of that, but I feel like I'm her brother or father and I'm just paying the bills for her lifestyle. Can't leave her because I can't stand leaving my beautiful children, not even for 1/2 the time.
Not sure what I expected in writing all of this. There is no true solution. Just needed to send it out into the universe so at least someone heard me.
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Post by Handy on Dec 8, 2021 15:35:12 GMT -5
Atlantic
I once found lingerie she had (held on to) from before the marriage.
women buy things because they think it is cool/sexy or think what ever. There may have been no other man.
All of the ILIASM members do hear you.
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Post by ironhamster on Dec 8, 2021 17:32:18 GMT -5
Can't leave her because I can't stand leaving my beautiful children, not even for 1/2 the time. Not sure what I expected in writing all of this. There is no true solution. Just needed to send it out into the universe so at least someone heard me. My condolences, brother atlantic. Hope and time are your only friends. Since you cannot leave, now, may I suggest that you take actions now that will make that move easier on you in the future. Also, get your wife some counseling. There may be a problem in her past she is coping with such as childhood sexual abuse. Marital counseling isn't something I have faith in, but it's good preparation for a time when the kids are grown. You can know you tried everything you could to save your marriage. Have hope for the future. There's more love and great sex out here than you can possibly imagine. |
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Post by baza on Dec 8, 2021 21:14:35 GMT -5
Your relationship with your kids "is what it is" as at today Brother atlantic . But your relationship with your kids is going to change (as it should) as time passes. You, as a parent, will move through being 'protector' to 'mentor' and your kids will also change, relying on you less and less. So like ironhamster suggests, you could be laying the groundwork now for what may be coming up in your future. For example, you could consult a lawyer in your jurisdiction to establish how a divorce would theoretically shake out for you. From that information you could put together a theoretical exit strategy. You could be shoring up your support network to - theoretically - help you through the process. You could be researching everything you can find about shepherding the kids through such an event. Creating this alternative commits you to precisely nothing. You might action it, you might not. That choice is down to you, but you'll do no harm in gathering the information now so you are basing your choices on the facts as they stand. |
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heelots
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Starving…
Dec 8, 2021 23:26:07 GMT -5
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Post by heelots on Dec 8, 2021 23:26:07 GMT -5
"If it were actually torture, wouldn't she skip a workout to stop it?" You are right. It's likely not torture for her or she has another outlet. "Why don't you leave?" I actually did at one point, not related directly to sexless marriage, but due to her communicating with an old boyfriend and then misleading me as I recovered from the trauma (long story there). I dug as hard as I could and could never find any proof of physical infidelity. Anytime I felt she was going to cheat, I had it so closely monitored I would know and she hasn't. She has no issue with long spells with no intimacy with me. Thinking maybe she never thought I was attractive in the first place and married because I was a Christian who showered her with attention. We got back together again because I sensed she was committed to the marriage and quite frankly I think both of us couldn't stand seeing what the separation was doing to our children who are quite young. The reality is that from Day 1 of the marriage it has been a challenge. I remember telling a counselor in Year 1 of the marriage I think my wife must have been sexually abused because she is so stiff and doesn't seem to relax when we are intimate. I never asked my wife, as I never wanted to insult her stiffness in bed. I have faith that God will resolve this, somehow, but I don't know how. Maybe that means He resolves it by making me stronger. I just know I'm suffering and at a point where I at least need to reach out via an anonymous forum. At least so someone understands. My 23 years with frigid wife has been much like you described, except for any threats of infidelity. I hope you have better luck than I have had. I have totally given up on my then wife, now room mate. I will stay because finances absolutely dictate I have to. It becomes easier if you ever get to that point to think of her as a room mate and not wife, at least it worked that way for me. Neither of us has laid a finger on each other or seen each other undressed in years. That is when you know your marriage really is done and in the shitter. |
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heelots
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Post by heelots on Dec 8, 2021 23:31:05 GMT -5
If my old lady was working out every morning and taking care of herself I would have to wonder if she was doing that for someone else, and if every morning she was working out on a machine, or sometimes another man?
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Post by Apocrypha on Dec 10, 2021 23:22:57 GMT -5
Was it the whole marriage? Yes. From the honeymoon (we made love the first night only, no imtimacy after that point) on, she has been hesitant and not "free" or "relaxed" with sex. When did it begin? From the start. I thought because we were Christians once we got married she should be into it. The frustrating thing is that I once found lingerie she had (held on to) from before the marriage. She has NEVER worn lingerie for me, not even on our honeymoon. So, she was vulnerable and sexy for other men (man?) but not me. That is absolutely frustrating. I've told her in the past I feel like I'm a resource being used up. I sincerely feel she is just using me. She doesn't work, she doesn't keep the house up that's appropriate. If we had intimacy, I would overlook all of that, but I feel like I'm her brother or father and I'm just paying the bills for her lifestyle. Can't leave her because I can't stand leaving my beautiful children, not even for 1/2 the time. Not sure what I expected in writing all of this. There is no true solution. Just needed to send it out into the universe so at least someone heard me. Ah, my own situation started to slide on the wedding night itself - a noticeable change that degraded with each level of further mutual investment. House. Pregnancies. I came to realize that while she had said "Yes" to marrying (actually, "why not?" - now that I think of it), that she did NOT actually want to be married to me. Hard to say "No" I guess - always was an issue with her. I've seen in other married and post marriage dating situations that it's common to use religious taboos as cover for various kinds of sexual avoidance. I've met and lived with several deeply closeted gay individuals who used religion as a crutch and focus, and others who were enjoying the virtuous excuse to avoid sex up until marriage while still feeling good about themselves. I take it that you were not sexually active with her prior to marriage? I've also known women in secular/athiest relationships who specifically sought men out who were religious or "complicated" - thinking these sex avoidant men were "deep" compared to the other men they knew who were chasing skirt. Then as they got farther into the relationship, the sex never came. The flipside of that could just as easily that they were drawn to the sex avoidance (resulting solely from piety), and then were not willing to deal with the expectation of sex once the relationship became a marriage. It's fair to say - based on what you said - that this is not just a sexual issue but rather a whole partner and "investment in the relationship and household enterprise" issue - and that's a common thing as well. Reframing the problem - this could be seen as a relationship dysfunction in which she's never really joined you in the relationship (she may not have wanted it in this format - like my own ex wife), and that doing things with you like sex or any other normal romantic expression ends up making her feel like she's endorsing a situation that she doesn't want to be in. And, likely she loves her kids too, and thus you at least have this in common, in understanding why neither of you can easily walk away. You CAN leave, or change the format of this relationship. So can she. But neither of you, to date, are prepared to pay the cost of of doing that - and that's totally understandable. You are right, there's no soft landing here, but when I'm faced with an unwinnable game, a way to approach it is to take the side of truth. What is the truth of your relationship, such that you'd both likely agree? Get down to basics - what is a marriage? What differentiates a marriage from an amicable separation and co parenting arrangement? Which of those two things is closer to the truth of your lived relationship today and in recent memory? |
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heelots
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Post by heelots on Dec 11, 2021 9:52:05 GMT -5
Was it the whole marriage? Yes. From the honeymoon (we made love the first night only, no imtimacy after that point) on, she has been hesitant and not "free" or "relaxed" with sex. When did it begin? From the start. I thought because we were Christians once we got married she should be into it. The frustrating thing is that I once found lingerie she had (held on to) from before the marriage. She has NEVER worn lingerie for me, not even on our honeymoon. So, she was vulnerable and sexy for other men (man?) but not me. That is absolutely frustrating. I've told her in the past I feel like I'm a resource being used up. I sincerely feel she is just using me. She doesn't work, she doesn't keep the house up that's appropriate. If we had intimacy, I would overlook all of that, but I feel like I'm her brother or father and I'm just paying the bills for her lifestyle. Can't leave her because I can't stand leaving my beautiful children, not even for 1/2 the time. Not sure what I expected in writing all of this. There is no true solution. Just needed to send it out into the universe so at least someone heard me. Amazing the parallels between your situation and my 23 years farce of a marraige. Our story could almost interchange! It took me most of the first 20 years to totally give up all hope on her and mentally relegate her to room mate status. Once I totally let go of any thoughts of sex with her it did make things some easier. That said, all the resentment remains, there is zero love and warmth. We have very vile arguements almost daily, and I seriously doubt either of us would shed a tear if the other dropped dead. I have no idea how many years you are into your personal hell, but if it goes anything like mine every passing year will add additional layers of resentment and at loathing for the source of your heartache and pain. Years before I reached this point I stopped observing B days, V day, Christmas etc. I finally decided to skip pretending and putting lipstick on a pig. |
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