dd
Junior Member
Posts: 50 
Age Range: 41-45
|
Post by dd on Dec 17, 2017 23:25:03 GMT -5
Just signed on but browsed on here off an on on lonely nights after rejection.
Been married to my wife for about 15 years. When we dating sex was fun but not earth-shattering.
Early in marriage frequency dropped, then after the first kid the whole world was different.
We now have three kids. But sex life has gone from many turn-downs and frustration to the point where about a year or two ago, she finally decided to go along with it more frequently when I approached, but I still approached very seldom. Most frequently would have been twice in one month. If I had to guess, I've had sex 10-12 a year for the past 12-14 years which is about 40 times a year to in-frequent.
Also, during the last 8 -10 years, the rules around sex have become to the point where sex is unimaginative.
The following rules have been in place some more recently than others.
Only in the bedroom
Only in bed
Only when dark
Only when she doesn't work the next day
Only after the kids are asleep
Don't wake her up
Only me on top
No oral (either way)
More recent
No kissing with tongue
No other unusual kissing
No neck or ears
Now the only kiss is a token peck like you'd give your own kid
No nothing else
My wife is non-affectionate. She doesn't appreciate hugs or touching for me. She loves to talk and talk with me though. That's what works for her.
Things have gotten worse recently. Earlier this year while having sex, she doesn't even like to kiss. She turned away when I tried to kiss her.
The last three times with sex, it has been as if she's been trying to make it so bad that I don't even want it.
The last time I tried shortly after my birthday (I've never gotten sex from her on my birthday or anniversary) it was equally as bad.
We barely talk about sex anymore because it's a sore subject and I feel like I can't even talk to her about it anymore, but I mentioned to her afterwards "You must really not like sex. You probably prefer going to a dentist appointment." To which she responded "I actually like going to the dentist to get my teeth cleaned".
At this point, I haven't tried since then. Part of me wonders how having her go through something she dislikes that much, only for me to get a short term orgasm from with no real affection is going to help bring us together.
I was visible upset the last couple weeks with work, and that. Last week she sat down on the couch and put her head against me which melts my heart. I can't stay angry at her. But it's an odd spot now. She's basically hoping that my sex drive disappears, and I'm living the rest of my life with an issue that's not getting solved or likely ever will.
|
|
|
|
Post by lwoetin on Dec 17, 2017 23:56:04 GMT -5
Rules, dentist, kissing... our wives are very similar. I don't know where these women are coming from. Venus? Can't wait for space travel and learn more about them.
|
|
dd
Junior Member
Posts: 50
Age Range: 41-45
|
Post by dd on Dec 18, 2017 0:26:23 GMT -5
Since I posted this, I've been reading other posts, and I could have just pasted "ditto" across several others.
I was reading another thread which outlined the steps that we refused go through, and it's shocking because I went through many of those steps as well.
At this point, I don't think it will get better ever, but the two biggest things are the idea of breaking up the family, and how rough it would be for her to re-enter the dating scene again.
We're the couple that people think are sane, reasonable, and who have things together, but over the course of years my friends have fallen out of contact, while we stay in close contact with hers.
Amount of time spent with respective families have become an issue lately. We are always hosting her family, but it's utterly painful for her to have my family over.
It's a problem area.
Recently she said I should make friends and get out more, but when I went one day to swing to my parents to visit a friend, she was visibly upset about why I was spending time out there.
Other friends who I had years ago, she had felt were "too rowdy", "swore around children too much", or were a bad influence on me.
Now I pretty much have no real friends.
So I second guess myself. I can't blame her for the lack of my friends, but at the same time it seems as if she's been manipulative without trying to be. (or maybe she was trying).
She says she loves me, but can't pick up a cue for a backrub when I really need one, or to give any physical touch.
|
|
|
|
Post by baza on Dec 18, 2017 0:32:25 GMT -5
It is a pretty standard story you tell here Brother dd . The sexual aspects of the deal she controls, your social life she controls, your family contact she controls, your circle of friends she reserves the right of veto over. Invariably in stories here there are further aspects of the deal the refuser spouse controls too. Things like money, child discipline etc etc. And you end up being a junior partner in the set up, disenfranchised from the decision making process. Your missus doesn't want you, but she does want you around, to play the role you are assigned - perhaps ATM, social accessory, chauffer, doer of mundane domestic tasks and suchlike. If you've been browsing here for a while you'll have seen what your options are. |
|
|
|
Post by h on Dec 18, 2017 5:35:43 GMT -5
Worrying about breaking up the family and how it will affect the kids is a valid concern and should be examined thoroughly. Worrying about how rough it would be for your W to re-enter the dating scene is not something you should worry about. She made the choice to neglect you and needs to live with the consequences of that decision, whatever those may be. If she is still interested in sex, she will find someone else. If she isn't, maybe she'll find herself an asexual guy or just stay single. Either way, it's not something you should worry about.
|
|
|
|
Post by james on Dec 18, 2017 8:49:27 GMT -5
Your story resembles mine uncannily. With the rules, I mean, most of which apply to me also. Very rarely is there a letup in them. I could add a couple more (I'm sure you could too): mostly not allowed to touch her anywhere with my hands; never when any visitors in the house (not that we ever were or are remotely noisy lol). Never during her period- that was a very early one and I'm sure would apply to you also. I would say that it goes much deeper than merely leading to unimaginative sex. When you have had your hand picked up and removed, so many times, like a child's, it feels a lot like rejection. Ultimately the whole thing culminated in sex without any foreplay whatsoever- just climb on and do it. Not quite starfish but as near as made no difference to me. One occasion when she really surpassed herself: she put her knees between herself and myself so that I couldn't actually get near her to have sex with her at all. I think that was her way of saying she didn't want to do it. Horrible.
Also similar in that my wife will talk and talk about her issues, difficulties, feelings. That is really important for her. Yes I always listen, and try to help (often just by listening).
It is strangely comforting to see that someone else has had such a similar experience.
|
|
|
|
Post by shamwow on Dec 18, 2017 10:42:12 GMT -5
Since I posted this, I've been reading other posts, and I could have just pasted "ditto" across several others. I was reading another thread which outlined the steps that we refused go through, and it's shocking because I went through many of those steps as well. At this point, I don't think it will get better ever, but the two biggest things are the idea of breaking up the family, and how rough it would be for her to re-enter the dating scene again. We're the couple that people think are sane, reasonable, and who have things together, but over the course of years my friends have fallen out of contact, while we stay in close contact with hers. Amount of time spent with respective families have become an issue lately. We are always hosting her family, but it's utterly painful for her to have my family over. It's a problem area. Recently she said I should make friends and get out more, but when I went one day to swing to my parents to visit a friend, she was visibly upset about why I was spending time out there. Other friends who I had years ago, she had felt were "too rowdy", "swore around children too much", or were a bad influence on me. Now I pretty much have no real friends. So I second guess myself. I can't blame her for the lack of my friends, but at the same time it seems as if she's been manipulative without trying to be. (or maybe she was trying). She says she loves me, but can't pick up a cue for a backrub when I really need one, or to give any physical touch. I'm curious as to why the difficulty of her re-entering the dating scene is of concern to you. My ex-wife is essentially asexual. She may or may not ever date again. However, this is no longer my concern. In all seriousness I hope that she finds a man who has some sort of sexual dysfunction who wants someone to care for him and who can provide her with the lifestyle she has grown accustomed to. I don't bear her ill will but also don't consider her happiness my responsibility anymore. |
|
|
|
Post by Dan on Dec 18, 2017 15:56:47 GMT -5
... At this point, I don't think it will get better ever ... Props to you for figuring this out. In my case it took 2 and a half decades of marriage, and then about three years on this forum and its predecessor. I hope your journey was shorter than mine. I also hope you can find a resolution that suits you. Me: still working on it. |
|
dd
Junior Member
Posts: 50
Age Range: 41-45
|
Post by dd on Dec 18, 2017 22:38:12 GMT -5
Your story resembles mine uncannily. With the rules, I mean, most of which apply to me also. Very rarely is there a letup in them. I could add a couple more (I'm sure you could too): mostly not allowed to touch her anywhere with my hands; never when any visitors in the house (not that we ever were or are remotely noisy lol). Never during her period- that was a very early one and I'm sure would apply to you also. I would say that it goes much deeper than merely leading to unimaginative sex. When you have had your hand picked up and removed, so many times, like a child's, it feels a lot like rejection. Ultimately the whole thing culminated in sex without any foreplay whatsoever- just climb on and do it. Not quite starfish but as near as made no difference to me. One occasion when she really surpassed herself: she put her knees between herself and myself so that I couldn't actually get near her to have sex with her at all. I think that was her way of saying she didn't want to do it. Horrible. Also similar in that my wife will talk and talk about her issues, difficulties, feelings. That is really important for her. Yes I always listen, and try to help (often just by listening). It is strangely comforting to see that someone else has had such a similar experience. Yes. Those rules also apply. Basically, nothing spontaneous. Nothing a night or two right after we had sex. (what, am I a sex maniac?) A lot of this has evolved to essentially anything sex-related is obscene and immature. Not when there are new sheets on the bed. No kissing anywhere other then a peck on her face or lips. Limited areas of touch with hands. Don't take too long. Etc. I've been blocked by knees before as well. It's one of those things where I wondered many times if she was the right one, and I'm essentially 51% yes, 49% no. The good things about her, she's incredibly reasonable and normally respectful. We're both respectful of each other, except when it comes to sex of course. It seems like she feels her ignoring my intimacy needs is like me missing the laundry hamper with my socks. (just an example, we don't have a laundry issue there). |
|
dd
Junior Member
Posts: 50
Age Range: 41-45
|
Post by dd on Dec 18, 2017 22:41:08 GMT -5
Since I posted this, I've been reading other posts, and I could have just pasted "ditto" across several others. I was reading another thread which outlined the steps that we refused go through, and it's shocking because I went through many of those steps as well. At this point, I don't think it will get better ever, but the two biggest things are the idea of breaking up the family, and how rough it would be for her to re-enter the dating scene again. We're the couple that people think are sane, reasonable, and who have things together, but over the course of years my friends have fallen out of contact, while we stay in close contact with hers. Amount of time spent with respective families have become an issue lately. We are always hosting her family, but it's utterly painful for her to have my family over. It's a problem area. Recently she said I should make friends and get out more, but when I went one day to swing to my parents to visit a friend, she was visibly upset about why I was spending time out there. Other friends who I had years ago, she had felt were "too rowdy", "swore around children too much", or were a bad influence on me. Now I pretty much have no real friends. So I second guess myself. I can't blame her for the lack of my friends, but at the same time it seems as if she's been manipulative without trying to be. (or maybe she was trying). She says she loves me, but can't pick up a cue for a backrub when I really need one, or to give any physical touch. I'm curious as to why the difficulty of her re-entering the dating scene is of concern to you. My ex-wife is essentially asexual. She may or may not ever date again. However, this is no longer my concern. In all seriousness I hope that she finds a man who has some sort of sexual dysfunction who wants someone to care for him and who can provide her with the lifestyle she has grown accustomed to. I don't bear her ill will but also don't consider her happiness my responsibility anymore. Well, because I love her and care for her. I know if we separated now, she'd be better off with someone else then being alone. It would be a hard shock I believe for her to get back into it. It seems to me, that for her getting married was more of a checklist of how to get through life, and the intimacy was just a precursor to getting married. Now from married, it goes to having kids. From having kids, to raising kids, etc. |
|
|
|
Post by shamwow on Dec 19, 2017 7:28:46 GMT -5
I'm curious as to why the difficulty of her re-entering the dating scene is of concern to you. My ex-wife is essentially asexual. She may or may not ever date again. However, this is no longer my concern. In all seriousness I hope that she finds a man who has some sort of sexual dysfunction who wants someone to care for him and who can provide her with the lifestyle she has grown accustomed to. I don't bear her ill will but also don't consider her happiness my responsibility anymore. Well, because I love her and care for her. I know if we separated now, she'd be better off with someone else then being alone. It would be a hard shock I believe for her to get back into it. It seems to me, that for her getting married was more of a checklist of how to get through life, and the intimacy was just a precursor to getting married. Now from married, it goes to having kids. From having kids, to raising kids, etc. I'm truly sorry to hear that, brother. Unrequited love is one of the saddest states the human condition can produce. If she loved and cared for you the way you obviously love and care for her, you would not be here in the first place. I loved my ex wife at one point. But as time went by, she killed off that love one day at a time. By the time I read her my divorce letter there really was nothing left but crying for her. I believe I was wise enough at that point to end things then before that warped into hatred and antipathy. On the other hand if I were truly wise I never would have married her in the first place. The signs were there if I'd had opened my eyes. |
|
|
|
Post by twotimesone on Dec 19, 2017 13:38:19 GMT -5
I'm curious as to why the difficulty of her re-entering the dating scene is of concern to you. My ex-wife is essentially asexual. She may or may not ever date again. However, this is no longer my concern. In all seriousness I hope that she finds a man who has some sort of sexual dysfunction who wants someone to care for him and who can provide her with the lifestyle she has grown accustomed to. I don't bear her ill will but also don't consider her happiness my responsibility anymore. Well, because I love her and care for her. I know if we separated now, she'd be better off with someone else then being alone. It would be a hard shock I believe for her to get back into it. It seems to me, that for her getting married was more of a checklist of how to get through life, and the intimacy was just a precursor to getting married. Now from married, it goes to having kids. From having kids, to raising kids, etc. I hear you and I am in the same shoes. The only way that we can have sex is if I go to her bedroom (yes we sleep on different beds) and she will lie down like a starfish and have sex. Financially, it is cheaper for me to just outsource than go thru a divorce especially with kids involved. When the kids are out of the house and I will be on my way too. |
|
|
|
Post by shamwow on Dec 19, 2017 15:25:24 GMT -5
Well, because I love her and care for her. I know if we separated now, she'd be better off with someone else then being alone. It would be a hard shock I believe for her to get back into it. It seems to me, that for her getting married was more of a checklist of how to get through life, and the intimacy was just a precursor to getting married. Now from married, it goes to having kids. From having kids, to raising kids, etc. I hear you and I am in the same shoes. The only way that we can have sex is if I go to her bedroom (yes we sleep on different beds) and she will lie down like a starfish and have sex. Financially, it is cheaper for me to just outsource than go thru a divorce especially with kids involved. When the kids are out of the house and I will be on my way too. Perhaps monthly it is cheaper (assuming due to child support) , but as people grow older they become more established. Your assets may grow over time and counter balance child support. Plus, if you are married for a longer period of time you may also be liable for spousal support (alimony). This usually tends to kick in as soon as the kids fly free. If you think you will eventually leave you should see a lawyer to see how it would shake out in both scenarios. You also have to take into account that outsourcing could blow up in your face at any time. Things can get really nasty as you get cast as the bad guy on the way out. |
|
|
|
Post by M2G on Dec 19, 2017 15:47:14 GMT -5
See - that's the thing: the refused is the "bad person" for outsourcing, but the refuser never has any stigma assigned. SM is one of those cases where doing nothing, sets in motion all kinds of bad - yet leaves the person causing it to walk away looking totally innocent while everyone blames the victim.
|
|
|
|
Post by twotimesone on Dec 19, 2017 15:54:03 GMT -5
I hear you and I am in the same shoes. The only way that we can have sex is if I go to her bedroom (yes we sleep on different beds) and she will lie down like a starfish and have sex. Financially, it is cheaper for me to just outsource than go thru a divorce especially with kids involved. When the kids are out of the house and I will be on my way too. Perhaps monthly it is cheaper (assuming due to child support) , but as people grow older they become more established. Your assets may grow over time and counter balance child support. Plus, if you are married for a longer period of time you may also be liable for spousal support (alimony). This usually tends to kick in as soon as the kids fly free. If you think you will eventually leave you should see a lawyer to see how it would shake out in both scenarios. You also have to take into account that outsourcing could blow up in your face at any time. Things can get really nasty as you get cast as the bad guy on the way out. Thanks, I hear what you are saying. I personally like to go home and have kids around the house. If I were to leave, and find another woman, I just have this pessimistic view of getting married and go thru another SM again. So my intention is that I don't want to get married again. As for the outsourcer, we don't know where each other live and the only way to contact her is using my burner phone which I text her. My W knows that I am already unhappy in the marriage, and she asked me the other day if the marriage wasn't the way I wanted. Emotionally, I am not going to invest in my marriage and me and my W knows it. As for the Financial part, I will probably retire early and then live in some 3rd world country as an dirty old man. By then, my W, who is a few years older than me, will probably be on medicare and the alimony would maybe be less of an issue. |
|
